Growmac Posted May 9, 2022 Report Share Posted May 9, 2022 Bit of an odd one this. My mk7 R developed a minor rear main oil seal leak at 66k. It was replaced using VW parts by a well regarded independent. 10 months and 9k miles later the same seal seems to be leaking again, badly this time. The car went in for a major service at the same independent, and came home smelling slightly of oil but with a clean bill of health. I assumed a spill during refilling. Next day I drove about 10 miles, left the car on the road as we were using the garage, then noticed a new patch of oil on the garage floor. And on the road when I moved the car. Oh dear. The car has lost about 0.5 litres of oil in about 10-15 miles. The garage are explaining that the VW part warranty is only valid if VW inspect the car directly, leaving me open to any costs the main dealer thinks necessary. The indy say their own warranty doesn't apply as it didn't leak for 10 months so clearly no problem with workmanship. I don't really see how I have any contractural agreement with VW here, my contract was with the garage that did the repair. They seem to want to shrug and say they can help on the labour costs on replacing it again. Can that be right? Assuming it's not something else, can this be my problem? It's a big job, so even discounted it's probably going to be £500. Any thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregozedobe Posted May 10, 2022 Report Share Posted May 10, 2022 Are you sure the leak is from the rear main seal ? That is a serious quantity of oil in such a short distance. Any chance they have mucked up the oil filter or drain plug ? That seems more likely than a rms suddenly developing such a big leak so quickly. Is your car a manual ? With an aftermarket clutch ? If so, research crank walk (and be prepared for unpleasant news). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deano Posted May 10, 2022 Report Share Posted May 10, 2022 As above, if the car was losing that much oil before the service you would have known about it. Seems strange to me that it has happened straight after the service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growmac Posted May 10, 2022 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2022 4 hours ago, gregozedobe said: Are you sure the leak is from the rear main seal ? That is a serious quantity of oil in such a short distance. Any chance they have mucked up the oil filter or drain plug ? That seems more likely than a rms suddenly developing such a big leak so quickly. Sadly it's not the filter or drain plug. A mate of mine who is a mechanic came out and jacked the car for me to check as I didn't know if it would be 'safe' to drive it back to the garage. It's a DSG, and it definitely wasn't losing any oil before the service. So yeah, it's weird such a big leak has developed coincident to the service, but on the other hand I can't think of anything they could have been doing that would have caused it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastandy Posted May 10, 2022 Report Share Posted May 10, 2022 33 minutes ago, Growmac said: Sadly it's not the filter or drain plug. A mate of mine who is a mechanic came out and jacked the car for me to check as I didn't know if it would be 'safe' to drive it back to the garage. It's a DSG, and it definitely wasn't losing any oil before the service. So yeah, it's weird such a big leak has developed coincident to the service, but on the other hand I can't think of anything they could have been doing that would have caused it. They have been known to be a weak spot on ea888 previous generations. Usually if replacing the rear main seal a new fine oil separator is a good idea to fit. A faulty fos can cause excessive crank case pressure and create the problem in the first place. More pressure will make the problem worse. I'm 100pc with you. Vw have no part in your contract of service with the garage. They diagnosed, replaced parts from their supplier. They warrant the parts and labour. And even if they don't warrant you have statutory rights and my thinking is a same failure after 10 months means it needs to be done again FOC. Maybe with checking crank case pressure this time or replacing the fos as well. That extra would probably fall to you as you didn't pay for that originally.... Is summary the garage diagnosed, supplied parts and labour. Vw are an irrelevance to your contract in this matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growmac Posted May 10, 2022 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2022 I have been doing some internet searching this morning, and the internet agrees with you: the crank case pressure is the likely cause. The Pressure Control Valve is apparently a known weak point and was redesigned a couple of years ago. Every site I can find talking about rear main seal failure stresses that the PCV needs to be replaced at the same time. And it wasn't. I put this to them by email about an hour ago. I'll mention the FOS too. I've just seen I have a missed call from the garage. Let's see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastandy Posted May 10, 2022 Report Share Posted May 10, 2022 The fine oil separator and pcv is the same integrated part on top of the cam cover I think. Don't believe there are 2 separate units. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growmac Posted May 23, 2022 Author Report Share Posted May 23, 2022 So I had the garage change the PCV and the leak has slowed dramatically but it still needs the seal changing. I'm going to get an aftermarket 034motorsport seal rather than OEM to see if that helps. The garage still aren't honouring the warranty. Haven't decided how hard I'm going to push yet. fastandy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastandy Posted May 23, 2022 Report Share Posted May 23, 2022 10 hours ago, Growmac said: So I had the garage change the PCV and the leak has slowed dramatically but it still needs the seal changing. I'm going to get an aftermarket 034motorsport seal rather than OEM to see if that helps. The garage still aren't honouring the warranty. Haven't decided how hard I'm going to push yet. MMmm. Well, what can you say, the pcv was faulty and more than likely the route cause. Up to you how to proceed. A conciliatory approach I suppose with a very cheap repair cost for you I suppose would alleviate things somewhat.... Thanks for the update... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growmac Posted May 24, 2022 Author Report Share Posted May 24, 2022 Yeah, does seem likely, but it does also suggest that they failed to address the root cause the first time round. Even a cursory search found multiple sites suggesting that the PCV caused RMS failures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastandy Posted May 24, 2022 Report Share Posted May 24, 2022 8 hours ago, Growmac said: Yeah, does seem likely, but it does also suggest that they failed to address the root cause the first time round. Even a cursory search found multiple sites suggesting that the PCV caused RMS failures. Yes. They should know it is standard practice to replace the pcv or test crankcase pcv pressure with a manometer. Esp so, if RMS is at low age and mileage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growmac Posted May 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted May 25, 2022 18 hours ago, fastandy said: Yes. They should know it is standard practice to replace the pcv or test crankcase pcv pressure with a manometer. Esp so, if RMS is at low age and mileage. I'd be interested if that's a practice that I can substantiate in any way? VW's eye watering quote for just replacing the RMS didn't include the PCV or the flywheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastandy Posted May 25, 2022 Report Share Posted May 25, 2022 I'm not sure what is written in the repair manual, you'd have to pay for erwin access for 1 hour and look. But, If you call an independent and ask what would they do and check to replace a rear main seal on a xx mile xx year car, I'm confident most would mention the pcv/fos assembly. Its the most likely cause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growmac Posted August 16, 2022 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2022 A quick update. Replacing the PCV, despite the garage's skepticism, slowed the leak to almost nothing. The aftermarket Rear Main Seals were out of stock so I decided to wait. In the interim got an engine warning light, a fuel purge code, but that turned out to be an unrelated and easily replaced perished hose; all the stop-start errors that accompanied that went away on hose replacement. The RMS is now changed for an 034Motorsport Billet Aluminium unit. The garage were very complimentary about how much better that part was than the crappy OEM item, and the leak is completely gone. Sanity also prevailed on the warranty front. I paid for the PCV and seal (about £230) and they paid the labour. Seems fair to me, all ends well. LouCyffer, gregozedobe, fastandy and 1 other 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastandy Posted August 16, 2022 Report Share Posted August 16, 2022 Good result. And sounds like the persistence struck a fair resolution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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